Fahrenheit 9/11.

[Princess]

I just got finished watching the trailor for this movie and I must say that I'm excited. While I don't always agree with Michael Moore, I enjoyed his "Bowling for Columbine" thoroughly. I like the fact that he brings a completely different side to a story whether it be 100% accurate or not. It is still nice to hear something different. This movie is considered to be a highly controversial film and some have stated it will "bring down the Bush administration." Well, I doubt that, but I'm still very enthusiastic about the film. Opens June 25th.

Trailor: Fahrenheit 9/11 (http://www.fahrenheit911.com/)
Michael Moore talks about his film: MichaelMoore.com (http://www.michaelmoore.com/index_real.php)

[4matic]

Michael Moore only shows one side to benifit his views and ideas. i will see the film for sure though.

[Kamie]

The author off Farenheit 451 Ray Bradburry is pissed at Moore for using the title Farenheit in his movie like that without even asking or a statment. Infact he called him a jerk. I found that sort of ironic.

[[NAKED] Mithis]

Moore is a nut and radical. I am not inerested in it.

[[NAKED] sidark]

Its funny cause, I like his movies.

Some say what he said is not real.

Most of the thing he says is stuff I heard years ago.
He just bring stuff up that the news dont show or wont say concerning a dramatic event.

[J.A.C]

Didnt he get a award for that movie in cannes..?

[Anonymous]

Fact: Moore made up about 80% of the crap that's said in his movies or only caught one side of the opinion to make his point "correct". His next movie will be crap...and so on..

[Princess]

Fact: Moore made up about 80% of the crap that's said in his movies or only caught one side of the opinion to make his point "correct". His next movie will be crap...and so on..

You're not really convincing me (I don't speak for all, but I'd like to) by stating the word "fact." It's probably better if you actually provide the information surrounding it instead of merely stating it. I'm not saying it's not true, but it'd be nice to know where that's coming from.

[Anonymous]

It was said on The Daily Show, The Countdown, Hardball, and on The O'Reilly Factor. He lies more than he tells the truth in his movies, so don't count on my opinion if you don't want when several publications tell it the way it is.

[Princess]

The Daily Show (http://www.onlisareinsradar.com/archives/000833.php)

Found nothing on "The Countdown" and I don't even know what that is.

I'm also having trouble finding anything on this "Hardball."

The O'Reily Factor (http://www.foxnews.com/column_archive/0,2976,79,00.html) <--please pick out the story in the archive that talks about Michael Moore's movies being mostly lies.

If you notice the information above, you will see that your claims hold no water. In fact, the conversation on the Daily Show was contrary! Please validate your statements so that I can better understand wth you're talking about.

[stormFury]

owned by princess. I still dislike michael moore although he does have the extroardinary ability to make the people he's interviewing look like complete morons, thus earning him an Academy Award. Whatever...

[Doc Wattson]

We've had threads on FCS that point out Micheal Moore's flaws, ferret probably has them in an archive. Moore is a great STORY teller. Sadly most people take his story telling as pure fact. He's a hypocritcal, pomposs ass. People on the left look over the cracks in his facade because they so desperatly want a figure to rally behind. Same could be said for Bush and people on the right. I have more trouble with Roger & Me then Bowling for Columbine but both movies shouldn't be taken seriously. This latest movie won the Canne award for best film but take that with a grain of salt. It's a award from a FRENCH film festival with hollywood types on the panel. Half the reason it won was so they could slap the Bush administration in the face. I think Roger Ebert put it most honestly when he said (paraphrasing), "Is Farenheit 9/11 a good film, I gave it a thumbs up. Did it deserve the Palm Award, probably not. Canne says that the polotics in the film had nothing to do with the award and I can't prove differently, but I'd bet all the money in the world if the film was pro Bush it wouldn't have been a Palm award finalist let alone winner."

-Gary-

[Princess]

I have no problem acknowledging that Michael Moore makes his information up. I have only seen "Bowling for Columbine," and I'm trying to find information refuting the things he said. When I look for that online, all I get is "we hate Michael Moore, it's not true." I'm simply not getting the type of information or sincerity that Moore gives and do not trust websites that start out with an "I hate..." At this point, I haven't found a reason not to believe certain things he says. For the record, I'd like to reaffirm my earlier statement in that I don't agree with everything he says. In fact, even in BFC, I had difficulty with some of his arguments. I know that he gives one side of things and can swing it VERY well, but he certainly does make my eyebrow rise. In fact, he talks about a lot of issues that I sincerely feel go unheard of --namely the welfare story. You're right though Doc, these movies shouldn't be taken to the extremes, but like many movies, they offer insight and a different perspective.

As a side note, I agree with Ebert's statement 100 percent.

[squeak]

Princess, I am falling for you :p

[[NAKED] Mithis]

I have no problem acknowledging that Michael Moore makes his information up.

I don't see how you can't have a problem with this. It is for this reason i don't watch his stuff. In fact in his new movie he claims to have interviewed a person that also claims he has never met Moore. I can't think of the name right now so when i get time later i'll try and look for it. Michael Moore presents his opinions as fact, and i am sorry that is wrong.

[Princess]

Mithis]I have no problem acknowledging that Michael Moore makes his information up.

I don't see how you can't have a problem with this. It is for this reason i don't watch his stuff. In fact in his new movie he claims to have interviewed a person that also claims he has never met Moore. I can't think of the name right now so when i get time later i'll try and look for it. Michael Moore presents his opinions as fact, and i am sorry that is wrong.

I think you misunderstood me. I thought it was covered in the following sentences, but whoops! Here: "I have no problem acknowledging that Michael Moore makes his information up if someone can give me adequate information on why he is doing this. From the sources that Michael Moore gives, I have been able to confirm the questions I had on the validity *repeat* for the questions I had. On the contrary, I have yet to receive any counter-information. I am open to the idea that he is making false statements until proven/suggested w/actual information otherwise."

Edit: In addition, from what I have seen of MM's work, he states actual *real* facts and then infers on them. Watching BFC, the entire time I wanted him to say "This causes this." Instead, in a very clever way, he correlates two separate facts by putting them close together with a "hmm" attitude. I could be wrong, I'm not sitting there analyzing it, but that was the impression I got.

[Dissman]

Mithis]I have no problem acknowledging that Michael Moore makes his information up.

I don't see how you can't have a problem with this. It is for this reason i don't watch his stuff. In fact in his new movie he claims to have interviewed a person that also claims he has never met Moore. I can't think of the name right now so when i get time later i'll try and look for it. Michael Moore presents his opinions as fact, and i am sorry that is wrong.

I think you misunderstood me. I thought it was covered in the following sentences, but whoops! Here: "I have no problem acknowledging that Michael Moore makes his information up if someone can give me adequate information on why he is doing this. From the sources that Michael Moore gives, I have been able to confirm the questions I had on the validity *repeat* for the questions I had. On the contrary, I have yet to receive any counter-information. I am open to the idea that he is making false statements until proven/suggested w/actual information otherwise."

Edit: In addition, from what I have seen of MM's work, he states actual *real* facts and then infers on them. Watching BFC, the entire time I wanted him to say "This causes this." Instead, in a very clever way, he correlates two separate facts by putting them close together with a "hmm" attitude. I could be wrong, I'm not sitting there analyzing it, but that was the impression I got.

Princess, i cannot do "why" for you... only Michael Moore can tell you why he lies. I would have to assume that he lies and makes up sources because the facts do not agree with him and the point that he's trying to propegandize... You cant go into a bank and walk out with gun, and that's a fact... In fact, I can document that he is indeed making up at least some of what he says and then documenting it as fact... he is probably doing this to much more of what he says, but i think this is sufficent for the cause of pointing out that he makes stuff up.

Moore wrote he'd once been "forced" to listen to my comments on a TV chat show, The McLaughlin Group. I had whined "on and on about the sorry state of American education," Moore said, and wound up by bellowing: "These kids don't even know what The Iliad and The Odyssey are!"

Moore's interest was piqued, so the next day he said he called me. "Fred," he quoted himself as saying, "tell me what The Iliad and The Odyssey are." I started "hemming and hawing," Moore wrote. And then I said, according to Moore: "Well, they're . . . uh . . . you know . . . uh . . . okay, fine, you got me--I don't know what they're about. Happy now?" He'd smoked me out as a fraud, or maybe worse.

The only problem is none of this is true. It never happened. Moore is a liar. He made it up. It's a fabrication on two levels. One, I've never met Moore or even talked to him on the phone. And, two, I read both The Iliad and The Odyssey in my first year at the University of Virginia.

The full story is available at:
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/004/127ujhuf.asp?pg=1
It also includes some other examples of lies and gives proof to back up that they are indeed lies. (possibly some that are not in his works, but are lies for publicity stunts)

Here's another one, that's by a bipartisan group that at one time were supporters of Moore until they could no longer accept his lies. They tore apart one of his books and pointed out fabrications and fact bending.
http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20031016.html

There are many other examples of people being able to document that his work is flawed, incorrect and in many cases, total and absolute bull****.

[ThriKreen]

I think the point is that we should question what we see and hear, and not just accept what is handed to us like sheep. Sure Moore's viewpoint is skewed, exaggerated, and biased, but you can say that about any information outlet.

Like I know for a fact not all houses in Canada are unlocked (heck, I have 4 sets of locks on my frontdoor), but obviously Moore's scene of randomly opening doors was edited to only show the doors that were unlocked (or staged altogether). Of course who's the say those discrediting him are any better? I mean, maybe the Fred Barnes article you linked to is him trying to cover up, who knows?

Ultimately there is one truth, we just have to listen to all the viewpoints and sort it out.

[Princess]

Princess, i cannot do "why" for you... only Michael Moore can tell you why he lies. I would have to assume that he lies and makes up sources because the facts do not agree with him and the point that he's trying to propegandize... You cant go into a bank and walk out with gun, and that's a fact... In fact, I can document that he is indeed making up at least some of what he says and then documenting it as fact... he is probably doing this to much more of what he says, but i think this is sufficent for the cause of pointing out that he makes stuff up.

Moore wrote he'd once been "forced" to listen to my comments on a TV chat show, The McLaughlin Group. I had whined "on and on about the sorry state of American education," Moore said, and wound up by bellowing: "These kids don't even know what The Iliad and The Odyssey are!"

Moore's interest was piqued, so the next day he said he called me. "Fred," he quoted himself as saying, "tell me what The Iliad and The Odyssey are." I started "hemming and hawing," Moore wrote. And then I said, according to Moore: "Well, they're . . . uh . . . you know . . . uh . . . okay, fine, you got me--I don't know what they're about. Happy now?" He'd smoked me out as a fraud, or maybe worse.

The only problem is none of this is true. It never happened. Moore is a liar. He made it up. It's a fabrication on two levels. One, I've never met Moore or even talked to him on the phone. And, two, I read both The Iliad and The Odyssey in my first year at the University of Virginia.

The full story is available at:
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/004/127ujhuf.asp?pg=1
It also includes some other examples of lies and gives proof to back up that they are indeed lies. (possibly some that are not in his works, but are lies for publicity stunts)

Here's another one, that's by a bipartisan group that at one time were supporters of Moore until they could no longer accept his lies. They tore apart one of his books and pointed out fabrications and fact bending.
http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20031016.html

There are many other examples of people being able to document that his work is flawed, incorrect and in many cases, total and absolute bull****.

Hehe, well, I just got done reading both of those links and am cross-checking a couple "lies" from the first link because I really didn't see anything in there that "proved" it to me. I can completely see how he could be commiting a publicity stunt, I've just yet to see the hardcore evidence. I almost feel like if he were to be commiting these types of lies there might be a decent investigation on the matter. In fact, considering that these news stations "don't approve" of his work, I almost feel like they should be the ones trying to show that his work is false instead of people I've (can't speak for everyone) never heard of. But that's just a preference of course. After reading the second link, I can kind of accept some of the things their saying. They had a lot of other links within them, so I'll have to check them out too. Unfortunately for me, I haven't read the book their refuting and can therefore not make a great judgment in either favor. Thanks for posting those links though Diss, I highly appreciate it.

-As for the ad of having a gun at a bank, he saw the article in 2001, it's possible he filmed it then and then the law was changed? I don't know, I'm actually just trying to find the ad w/the information he provided on his website.

[squeak]

Princess, marry me. You hold a conversation so strong yet so un-offending.

[Dissman]

I'm going to go point by point, because... you say a lot, and it's best to reply to each point individually.

Hehe, well, I just got done reading both of those links and am cross-checking a couple "lies" from the first link because I really didn't see anything in there that "proved" it to me. I can completely see how he could be commiting a publicity stunt, I've just yet to see the hardcore evidence.

Unfortunately, it's kind of hard to disprove a phone call... i'm sure if he really wanted to prove it... he could drag up phone records, but in a way, he really doesnt have to... A proper list of sources, usually records a date and time... i think that Michael Moore needs to prove that the call happened more than Mr. Barnes needs to disprove it... I doubt he'd rant on national TV about people having no idea what the odyssey is if he didn't... and then to fess up to it to Michael Moore... honestly, how did he get Fred Barnes'es number in the first place.. i think one sentance in the article was telling.

In Stupid White Men, he has 18 pages of "Notes and Sources," but he offers no evidence for the sham interview with me--no date, no transcript. How could he, since the interview never happened?

I almost feel like if he were to be commiting these types of lies there might be a decent investigation on the matter.

1) Libel and Slander are civil offenses, these kinds of things dont get serious criminal style investigations unless you.
a) lie under oath (perjury)
b) are president of the united states

(b: was an article of impeachment for Nixon "Lying to the american people")

In fact, considering that these news stations "don't approve" of his work, I almost feel like they should be the ones trying to show that his work is false instead of people I've (can't speak for everyone) never heard of. But that's just a preference of course. After reading the second link, I can kind of accept some of the things their saying. They had a lot of other links within them, so I'll have to check them out too. Unfortunately for me, I haven't read the book their refuting and can therefore not make a great judgment in either favor. Thanks for posting those links though Diss, I highly appreciate it.

Here, this is the link for their article on "Bowling for Columbine"
http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20021119.html

Most of these bombthrowers... people like the Michael Moore's, Al Franken's and others of the world when they produce works are written off as cooks no matter which side they are on and are not taken seriously by most people as well as most major news outlets... therefore most of them dont bother to waste their time to pick him apart... it's only when someone realizes that he's either rewritten the truth or has lied, and either screams "bloody murder" or files a lawsuit against an author is it covered by the major news media...

Your Welcome Princess.... Anytime.

[WangChung]

I liked Bowling for columbine as well. but when i actualyl found out the truth, i was weary about hearing about Fahrenheit 9/11..
http://home.sprynet.com/~owl1/bowling.htm

Now an anti-Moore documentary

http://home.sprynet.com/~owl1/bowling.htm

[zouyan]

Michael Moore is a radical person, and you are all in your rights to love or hate him. But you must realize, EVERYONE represents facts to support their own views. You wouldnt expect Rumsfeld to come out and say, "The prisioner abuse was an isolated icident, and does not represent the United States. HOWEVER, on the flipside, our torture of those prisoners is why everyone in the middle east hates us and think's we're evil."

[Dissman]

Michael Moore is a radical person, and you are all in your rights to love or hate him. But you must realize, EVERYONE represents facts to support their own views. You wouldnt expect Rumsfeld to come out and say, "The prisioner abuse was an isolated icident, and does not represent the United States. HOWEVER, on the flipside, our torture of those prisoners is why everyone in the middle east hates us and think's we're evil."

Yet, Michael Moore rarely represents facts, he does his damndest to misrepresent them to his own political advantage, and when the facts dont support what he's saying, he's not opposed to making them up.

[WangChung]

yep. clickky on my links to see

[zouyan]

"HE BOUGHT URANIUM, OMG!"

Im just saying everyone does it. I can understand if you dont think his movies should fall under the documentary catagory though.

[[NAKED] Mithis]

Here's another good link.

http://bowlingfortruth.com/

[Canon]

It was said on The Daily Show, The Countdown, Hardball, and on The O'Reilly Factor

...so, no credible backing for your assertion?

[[NAKED] Young DVP]

canon, where ya been dude?

[Canon]

I was without an internet connection for a while... personal drama and whatnot. I'm back now. :)

[J.A.C]

im gonna watch it..

[[gh]Spurty]

I take what people like Michael Moore say with a pinch of salt. I like the fact he is into exposing things and getting crap out into the open, but I can't see his agenda behind the hate. If he were 100% neutral, I'd probably give him more time/credit

[Captain Kirk]

im going to watch it

[squeak]

im going to bake a pie

[stormFury]

In a way, Michael Moore is profiting off of the events of 9/11. I hope he gets hit by a city bus. Stupid fat pedophile-faced man.

[Canon]

Wish granted... but just as the bus smears Moore's hulking, gellatinous frame all over the pavement, the driver loses control and veers off the road.

The smirking cynicism is instantly wiped from your face as 3 tons of steel crush your feeble bones against the cinderblock wall behind you at 50mph. You lay there... amidst the dusty rubble... swallowing blood... trying desperately to turn on to your side so as not to choke to death. As you turn your head you can feel vertebrate cracking... your head falling limp against a broken block. You note that your right arm is missing... it's existenced evidenced only by the ebbing geyser of blood and the tentacles of torn connective tissue.

As the energy seeps from your body you slip quietly into darkness... cursing Moore and his idiocy... glad that your wish brought on his demise.

[stormFury]

Um... that wasn't a 'wish' per se. Just that he deserves to die a horrible death. You didnt have to make me feel nauseas with that horrific description there =\

[Captain Kirk]

micheal moore is great too bad you guys cant see that

[Thordic]

micheal moore is great too bad you guys cant see that

http://www.thordic.com/images/asshataward.gif

[Captain Kirk]

thx apache

[Thordic]

Anytime.

[squeak]

canon. I want you. :-p

[Canon]

I know... it's mutual, mallow.

[[gh]Spurty]

Ok, I listened to an interview with Moore over the 9/11 film (Talk radio, 69.9FM in the New England area).

He clearly states that the film is only his opinion of what happened. Some of the facts he uses as the center for his thinking are not really facts, but opinion based on public theory.

UT OH ..

Well, perhaps he mispoke, but when pushed to cite a credible source for one of his 'opinions' he admitted that it was agreed in some meeting around a table of writers, not really good old fashioned leg work.

He also admitted something about republican presidents being fairer game than democratic ones. I don't have a clue what that meant, I'm from the UK where you have Conservative, Labor and Loony, I mean liberals (full list http://bubl.ac.uk/uk/parties.htm)
and they are all fair game for someone to have a dig at.

[[gh]Spurty]

Doesn't make him wrong,or right .. but somewhere in between

Ok, anyone who watches Spitting Images will probably laugh at that (Its a sketch about Paddy 'Pantsdown' Ashcroft who is like John Kerry, not sure which side he is on at times. He was caught knobbling the secretary. "I didn't touch her left knee, or her right knee, it was somewhere inbetween")

I'll get my coat ..

[Princess]

Well, thank you all for the wonderful information. Sorry for the absense of this thread I was so passionate about, I've been having some eye problems and have just started to see better. I've finally gotten the opportunity to look through some of those links and I've also had a few discussions irl that have changed my opinion. My opinion has not changed drastically, but it's interesting to read all of that information about his sources. Some of the links contained very pettifogged ideas that I felt really didn't convince me of anything, while others were like "booyah!" In any case, I appreciate the links and when I get even more time maybe I'll try to cross-check their info too.

I think Spurty summed it up pretty well that he's somewhere inbetween. =P.

@marsh: Thanks for the offer, but I am already with the person I intend to marry. =P.

[zouyan]

Well, i just watched the movie earlier this afternoon. It was a good movie, but i enjoyed Roger and Me and Bowling for Columbine much better. I felt that Moore tried to tie in too many points into the movie so many things were spread too thin and at times felt awkword that it was included in the movie.

As usual, Moore made alot of good points, but as usual, those were compounded with many rediculous ones.

The most interesting one for me was this constant state of "OMG WE GONNA GET ATTAKED" has allowed the adminstration to push through so many bills that clearly violate our rights. Also interesting that he ended the movie whit a quote from 1984, which was cool since i loved the book. I cant find where in the book the quote is from anymore and its killing me, could someone please tell me?

Anyways, go see this movie, cause it has its humor, but also some graphic scenes. But dont be stupid and go see it only to get more ammunition to rip it apart later. And dont come out of it agreeing 100% with moore, take everything with a grain of salt.

[stormFury]

I think this movie will be much better and more accurately based on fact. (www.michaelmoorehatesamerica.com/)

Trailer: http://www.michaelmoorehatesamerica.com/trailer_sm.html

[WangChung]

go SF. u tell 'em. :) i thought that MM was such a bastard after reading up on the Bowling for Columbine documentary.

[zouyan]

Its funny that he's making it movie like Roger and Me where he tries to get to talk to Moore.

But it looks like to me the bulk of the movie is going to be him going around asking people "WHY DO YOU LOVE AMERICA?"

what gives you the impression that moore hates america?

[WangChung]

because he is decieving the public by slick editing skills and misdirection, and has his own agenda to pursue. there's a thread w/ a link that analyzes Bowling for Columbine.. some of it is staged, other's is edited to make something else seem true.

[DarkWHITE]

he's like the David Copperfield of documentaries

[ferret]

because he is decieving the public by slick editing skills and misdirection, and has his own agenda to pursue.

And the administration doesn't do the same? Come now.

[Thordic]

so if both sides lie, then its ok?

Fighting lies with lies is the way to go.

[zouyan]

if you cant enjoy anything that has some lies in it, the there's nothing in life that you can enjoy. i've said it before, i dont really care that he lies, i find his movies amusing. but realize he's just a filmmaker doing an editorial

i have a problem with my goverment telling me lies, persuing their own agenda because it actually affects me.

just because you think he's "deciving the public" that means he hates america? come on. i think he likes america but doesnt like the direction that its heading so he's trying to point out its problems. if he truly hated america, he would just leave. he wouldnt be staying around trying to change things.

[Captain Kirk]

ferret abd apache did you actually watch the movie?

[ferret]

ferret abd apache did you actually watch the movie?

Me? No. I consider Moore a radical/zealot. I can't stand zealots, left or right wing. It just seems funny for people to be calling out a "powerless" person for lying when the most powerful lie daily.

[Captain Kirk]

so i guess you didnt watch bowling for columbine either?

[ferret]

I'd have to vote no on that as well :) It simply didn't interest me. I've seen the one where he talks to Nike and shit though. Columbine was a combination of retards not doing their jobs, much like 9/11.

[kael]

You can't come him powerless, because of his movie he effects other people and some who are not strong minded take everything as fact and are delisuional of the reality that really does exist. A man in his position does have power.

Right now Ill say my juvenille statement but yet its so true. If you do not like America GET OUT! Theres flaws ofcourse in our government, but look at other governments and they arent too much better. We have the freedom to make these movies other people don't. So go across the border or something if you hate America.

[ferret]

Please. You people are so silly. Its ridiculus to think anyone on this board hates America. Its also retarded when people consider opposition to war or Bush to be "america hate"

[kael]

You can oppose bush and the war simple, I was just stating that for the ridiculus people in our country(might not be on our forums unless Moore is actually Airwalk, would explain alot)

[stormFury]

Whatever happened to GND and i,Zombie? They always had interesting thoughts on such matters

[ferret]

angry pothead guy is GND I do believe. Zombie is dealing with RL these days, hopes to return in the future. I last spoke to him about a month ago.

[zouyan]

If you do not like America GET OUT!

yes, america for americans. we dont need anyone besides white males age 18-35...

:roll:

[WangChung]

yes, america for americans. we dont need anyone besides females age 18-35... hygenic... friendly...

:roll:

[Low-Light]

I saw the movie... And beh it was aright. It was just giving information that was there which some of us are just too blunt to pick up.

I mean bush is a character... All presidents have their flaws. If we had a D president. Hes not going to be perfect either.

We could of had a movie about Cliton too?

I mean i'm not a hard core anyone.. its just I dont like how people who are not all well informed and are swung by the media use it to judge. All the people in theaters.. Are like ready to tear up the screen.

I donno its just all propganda. You can do a movie on anyone and dig up all the stupid dumb things and make it seem bad.

My post here which is totally neutrual might seem like a bush supporter post but its not. I'm just saying Things happen and we just have to learn from them.

Once you start to go against things. Then all will fall. Improve on the bad things and everything will come together slowly but surely.

[acme420]

I saw this movie last night and i thought it was good and presented the facts clearly. its not like any of the shit in it was made up, it all happened and he docmented it.

i havent read through this whole thread yet but i plan to later today, opun my skimming this last page of the thread i read something about "opposition to bush != america hate"

and you see thats the thing people are so focused on their one side republican / democrat that theyre not even thinking straight anymore.

like the woman in the movie who lost her sone in iraq she way all angry and pissed off about the people protesting war , isnt that why supposedly all these wars in the past were fought to protect our freedoms one of which is the right to free speech yet as soon as someone speaks out against the majority theyre a fukn commie bastard or theyre unamerican and if they dont like it here they need to get the **** out. its ridiculous.

ill have more later when i have finished reading the whole thread and gathered my thoughts.

[steaLer]

i saw the movie and i agree with most he said. granted, that the info was hand-picked and made to look Bush a failure, but it's not wrong. the concepts he is trying to conway is true.

true, all politicians and CEO's are corrupt; but i don;t see any other president (republican or democrat) in US history taking corruption to this high level and selling out U.S. i mean, killing innocents for oil/money/politics is not acceptable level of corruption.

4 years of arrogance/stupidity/un-precedented corruption/**** all attitude is enough. hope he does not get re-elected, or GOD HELP US.

[[NAKED] sidark]

People think that Moores hates the republican, its not that. Its really Bush that he hates, and he shows his point of view with this movie , to not elect Bush.

Americans that lives here, that seen the movie, hates to say they are american beacuse Bush represent US at the moment.

[ferret]

sidark]People think that Moores hates the republican, its not that. Its really Bush that he hates, and he shows his point of view with this movie , to not elect Bush.

Disagree. Moore has been around for a LONG TIME. Long before Bush came in office.

[Kamie]

When it comes to politics, I am actually an independent, in the middle type of thinker. I do not like voting by the party but by the canidate, who they are, what they stand for, and who supports them. I did not get to vote in the last election due to the fact I was in the hospital durring election time. And I hope that I do not go into labor near election day so I can actually get to vote this go around. I am considering doing an absentee ballot thing.

But that aside, I just wanted to say this:

1.) For the "if you do not like how things in America are then leave" argument: um...no. If you do not like how things are in America then get off your lazy but, stop whining and do something about it. Use your voice, vote, and be active.

2.) Newsflash, there are a lot of conservitaves and republicans who are not going to vote for Bush this election because they do not like how things are going. Bush does have a lot of shady connections, has floundered foreign relations, and has done a good job and messing some critical things up.

3.) If we had a movie about Clinton, we would not be able to see it in theaters, it would probably have an X or NC-17 rating on it.

4.) You can bend and edit footage for whatever purpose you want. Moore does it over and over, the Daily Show does it, reality TV shows do it, and so does Bush.

[Low-Light]

3.) If we had a movie about Clinton, we would not be able to see it in theaters, it would probably have an X or NC-17 rating on it.

lol boo How about JFK and his Supposed encounters with Marilyn Monroe lol That make a good movie.

[Kamie]

I never said it wouldn't :)

[Kamie]

http://img.coxnewsweb.com/B/02/32/50/image_750322.jpg

[Princess]

LOL! I agree with you Kamie. (Congrats, btw!)

[zouyan]

Colin Powell is the man

[[gh]Spurty]

I saw this movie last night and i thought it was good and presented the facts clearly. its not like any of the **** in it was made up, it all happened and he docmented it.\

Oooof careful .. Mr Moore is on record stating that not everything in there is factually correct as portrayed and he used some Hollywood magic to cover the holes knowing that people are too weak minded to recall the order things happened.

I think he does an interesting job with the Twin towers falling being audio only, yet the mother crying about her Sons in Iraq was very very clear.

The reason for this was obvious. Show the twin towers falling and you gain strength in the Bush court. Don't and you give the advantage elsewhere.

Not that I have any issues with what he is doing, I'm all for it however its on political issues which are never black and white.

He should go back to fighting businesses again. I loved it when he slammed big businesses for malpractices. His big entrance into the Political arena marginalises his ability to cut to the chase and deliver a punchline.

Got to admit, there were some very classic moments of insincerity from Bush, but go back to Clinton years and you can see worse.

Oh and before I leave, John and John, the two Johns. Brilliant. The UK are lapping that up. The Two Johns are a comedy team who play politicians doing very very bad things. Can't wait to see the comedy this is going to generate

If I can find any of their work on the net, I'll treat you to it as they were obviously years ahead of us all